LoveLoveChina Forums

 
You must be logged in to post Login Register


Register? | Lost Your Password?

Search Forums:


 






Minimum search word length is 4 characters – Maximum search word length is 84 characters
Wildcard Usage:
*  matches any number of characters    %  matches exactly one character

Traditional Chinese Medicine

UserPost

4:30 pm
April 27, 2011


ZhuBaJie

21

Or so you've heard…Wink

7:31 pm
April 27, 2011


Louisa

22

I take 京都念慈菴川貝枇杷膏 when I have a sore throat/cough. It's this minty sweet black stuff that I find really helps my throat feel better. I gave it to my white roommates while in college and they also love it pieces, calling it "what cough drops are made of." Every Chinese family I know has a bottle of this stuff in their medicine cabinet (and now some Jewish ones, haha).

My family (read: mom and dad) buy into the bird's nest soup and hasma medicinal qualities, so I regularly have bird's nest soup (hasma's for men apparently). My dad also drinks this tea made from what looks like silk worms but is apparently a plant (I forget what it's called, but apparently the best are from Dongbei). And once in a while I'm forced to drink this nasty black soup made from boiling lingzhi.

It's quite incorrect to dismiss all of TCM as rubbish. A lot of traditional herbs have actually been scientifically verified to hold some health benefits, like ginseng, sweet wormwood, and the aforementioned lingzhi. 

My parents have a Chinese medicine doctor who comes by every so often to give massages and do other Chinese medicine things. But we stopped going to Chinese herbalists for medicine ever since my mom was hospitalized after taking some really strong Chinese medicine and couldn't breathe.

8:14 pm
April 27, 2011


ZhuBaJie

23

I think there is a lot to Chinese medicine, especially the herbs. The problem is, from a Western point of view, the studies have not been adequate so we can't use our scientific approach to understand how they work. Also, since they're not regulated (kind of like other supplements and homeopathic remedies), how do we know how much to take? 

 

Many years ago I took some Chinese herbs to help me relax. These were the kind you have to boil and then drink (yuk). The result was a lowering of my resting heart rate from 75 to the lower 50s — great, but the problem was that I almost blacked out on the freeway twice after that. I quit taking them. But they were definitely effective, and I still do credit them for lowering my heart rate and helping me relax: my heart rate has crept back up to about 58 resting in the 10 years since, which gives me no problems at all and is an improvement from 75. Again, no regulation and not as good a system for controlling how much is ingested.

 

Recently I took some Chinese herbal pills made here in the US specifically for allergies common to my area. They worked wonders, much better than any western medicine I have taken. Luckily, no overdose this time!Cool

1:49 pm
April 28, 2011


Bored in Melbourne

24

I read recetly that a very effective treatment for local area allergies is to eat some honey produced locally, as the bees would have used local pollen.  Luckily enough my parents have a hive at the bottom of their garden and I used their honey for a while and it did stop my hay fever symptoms.  Honey can be an effective medication for some things including an antiseptic on wounds.  I guess there must be a few interesting compound in honey considering it effectively last forever with no additional stabilizers.

3:28 pm
April 28, 2011


Ally

25

Traditional Chinese medicine is made by various herbs boil a medicine soup, flavour is bitter . Guangdong herbal tea also is a kind of Chinese medicine. Guangzhou is hot, humid climate very susceptible to colds, sore throat, cough, face the acne,This time need to drink  Guangdong herbal tea.

Why I smile? Coz you make me smile..`‵

7:12 pm
April 29, 2011


Elijah

26

Sorry, I still stand by my post. Traditional Chinese Medicine is a complete load of shit 95% of the time.

 

Let's see what the options are when dealing with it.

 

1) Completely unregulated homeopathic (ie: old wive's tales based on folklore….) where by law in civilized countries they are required to state that this medicine is not meant as a cure, treatment, diagnosis or prevention of anything. Seriously, read the fine print.

 

2) Extremely anecdotal and subjective testimony with absolutely no empirical evidence to back it up.

 

3) Supposedly "slow-acting" "natural" "herbal" "insert-any-feel-good-adjective-here" effects which if properly diagnosed by a REAL doctor in a REAL hospital could have been treated much more effectively and faster with REAL medicine. Not to mention that the whole point of medication is to speed up and support the body's natural immune system response… not go the same speed or slower. It's surprisingly similar to something else I've read….. hmmmmm oh yeah http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P…..ebo_effect HERE IT IS!!!

 

4) Bad medicine based on mysticism and quackery. Wherein the underlying condition is rarely if ever correctly diagnosed and treated and the appropriate measures aren't applied. Then, if you actually do managed to be correctly diagnosed by some stroke of luck, the treatment is rarely if ever effective or in many cases worsens it. There's even been numerous cases of new conditions being cause by these shams and con-men.

 

5) Combine the terms "unregulated" with "chinese business practices" and really what can you hope for?? "No nurse, the solution should be 10% but we need to stretch it a bit, so go to 5% and use mercury for the rest"

 

6)  The 5% of Traditional chinese "medicine" that has proven to be effective is and has been studied quite thoroughly and is widely available at your local drugstore. Why? Because medicine that works is worth a lot of money. Besides, if a broken clock can be right twice a day, then eventually some of those herbs and teas etc. will actually contain something useful and sensible. And since everything is made up of chemicals, it can be reproduced again and again and again an again.

 

7) You get to deal with incredibly subjective terms including (but not limited to) eating too much "hot" or "cold" food (absolutely nothing to due with temperature of course, that would be logical) or your "qi" pathways have been blocked (of course when you say qi it's makes sense, but saying it in English as energy totally nullifies the effect somehow….. ) etc. etc. etc. 

 

8) However the worst yet is the immensely damaging effect on the world's wildlife eco-system. The unmitigated cruelty propogated against animals is unconscionable. The atrocities inflicted against the innumerale endangered species of the world makes the dark spots in Human History (Killing Fields, Rwanda, Darfur, The Great Famine, Stalinist Purges, Cultural Revolution, Holocaust etc. etc.) look almost acceptable. Those butchers who will gladly tell you all about the sins of Unit 731 and how all Japanese should die will easily turn around and slaughter any animal for profit, will cage any animal for as long as they live, will cut limbs off, drain fluids from daily, mutilate and torture and neglect these animals without a second thought.

 

So yeah, keep going on and on about how effective that horsecrap is, pretend to yourself and others how openminded it is to embrace and accept other forms of medicine, keep in mind what's happening behind the scenes. Everytime you buyfrom one of those little shops or from a "Traditional chinese medicine" company you're helping to support it, all of it, not just the herbal teas and soups etc., all of it.

There's always another way……..

Usually my way.

7:20 pm
April 29, 2011


Elijah

27

Ok, so wow, that was a bit longer and stronger than expected….

 

Still true and I still stand by it though.

 

In case any of you might've noticed, I'm a total animal rights fanatic. One of the things that I truly believe in is that if you're looking for perfection, seek Nature. Nature is so much better than humans because we're not a seperate system (as we desperately believe), but just one of countless sub-systems.

 

I treat my cat (Wuming…. sounds better than calling him Nameless or No Name….) like any other person. Actually better since I also clean his box…. Fat-ass little son of a bitch…..

 

Anyways, I'll flip the switch on my rant mode and go to bed now.

 

G'night!

There's always another way……..

Usually my way.

10:08 pm
April 29, 2011


Crystal

28

I think that simply denying Traditional Chinese Medicine is not constructive. 

Instead it should be tested in clinical experiments. Maybe in such way the modern medicine will be enriched with new formulas.

 

One more thing in defense of TCM. There is such field of medicine called ethnic pharmacology – it studies how people of different races and cultures respond to medicines. Very well maybe that some medicines are good for Chinese but are not good for Westerners (and on the contrary).

As example, take the differences in national cuisines and dietary habits.

Many Asians have diarrhea when eating the Western food, while Westerners develop so-called "Chinese Restaurant Syndrome" when dining in China. 

10:25 pm
April 29, 2011


Bored in Melbourne

29

I once took a photo of a 'stall' if you could call it that in a street market in the far edge of China.  The trader was selling all type of animal parts evidently 'known' to be medicinal cures.  In the photo was a pelt of a cat.  I later realized it was a snow leapard.

 

I understand that they are an endangered species and here I see in front of me some idiot doing their best to reduced their numbers further for NO GOOD REASON.   Why couldn't they exterminate the black rat for example?

 

I am sure that is the only snow leopard I will ever see in my life, probably only a few thousand people in the world will see one in their natural habitat, unfortunately I did not feel so lucky 

5:54 am
April 30, 2011


Ally

30

TCM has millennium medical background, doesn't deny it no medical value There is no denying the fact is that China's medical equipment in backward and no foreign advanced. Treated in hospital you have to rely on medical aid , Whether it's traditional Chinese medicine, western medicine still can heal is a good medicine. When I was sick, I also suitable to Chinese medicine and western medicine . Contemporary medical also has improved a lot , Traditional Chinese medicine also mix western medicine to development .

Why I smile? Coz you make me smile..`‵

8:46 am
April 30, 2011


Kevin

31

Crystal said:

I think that simply denying Traditional Chinese Medicine is not constructive. 

Instead it should be tested in clinical experiments. Maybe in such way the modern medicine will be enriched with new formulas.


They already do. Traditional Chinese Medicine that has been proved by science is known as "medicine".

9:16 am
April 30, 2011


Elijah

32

Crystal said:

I think that simply denying Traditional Chinese Medicine is not constructive. 

Instead it should be tested in clinical experiments. Maybe in such way the modern medicine will be enriched with new formulas.

 

One more thing in defense of TCM. There is such field of medicine called ethnic pharmacology – it studies how people of different races and cultures respond to medicines. Very well maybe that some medicines are good for Chinese but are not good for Westerners (and on the contrary).

As example, take the differences in national cuisines and dietary habits.

Many Asians have diarrhea when eating the Western food, while Westerners develop so-called "Chinese Restaurant Syndrome" when dining in China. 


Sorry Crystal (and Ally), but No….. Just NO.

 

Until there is EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE rather than anecdotal tales, this so called "medicine" is absolute rubbish. I'm not even denying it, because by denying it, there would actually have to be something serious to deny. 

 

As for the food reference, that's not even in the same category. Food is something that you're raised up with and you digestive system comes to rely and become accustomed to. There is no comparison between food choices and actual medicine.

 

Another misconception that people seem to have is that there's this divide and distance between so called Eastern "medicine" and Western medicine. There's no such divide. There is only MEDICINE. People who try to implant that idea of a divide are only doing so in the hopes that it will become a cultural arguement and therefore too subjective to be conclusive.

However, Medicine is a SCIENCE, not a culture attribute. If something is effective, it earns the distinction of being real medicine, no matter where it's from. As I mentioned before, any effective ingredient can be tested empirically and than reproduced again and again. 

 

As for having thousands of years of history, don't make me yawn…. If it's really so effective and has so much medical value, why is it that the vast majority of people with any formal education and enough money go to see a real doctor in a real hospital for real treatment with real medicine? Yeah, keep holding on to superstious nonsense while Real Medicine keeps developping and leaves this crap in the past where it belongs.

 

Might as well go back to trepanning to relieve people of demons or start diagnosing people as having too much phlegm in their circulation…. That's ancient as well, doesn't that make it real? Or attributing everything to be made up of Earth, Wind, Water and Fire….

 

Now I miss Captain Planet….. I'm sure he'd have something to say to those sub-human monsters who make and sell traditional chinese "medicine"

 

Oh and I haven't seen anyone refute ANY of the points I made…

There's always another way……..

Usually my way.

11:10 am
April 30, 2011


Ally

33

For western medicine and TCM, I also does not want to make any damage of all parties remarks. I'm a moderate Traditional Chinese medicine with western medicine each have advantages . I will also know how to respect western medicine .

Laugh

Why I smile? Coz you make me smile..`‵

6:53 pm
April 30, 2011


China Shark Mike

34

Until Traditional Chinese Medicines come under the guidelines of some international medical organization it doesn't hold weight. First of all some of these snake oil salesmen/women are selling potentionally toxic naturals herbs that can build up in your internal organs. If they can't be dispursed quickly enough in one's system yeah that's right I think it's called renial failure I think. Organs shutting down. Over the last 2 and a half years I've take Chinese remedies with nothing but more problems along the line. I have few serious health issues yet am petrified going to a mainland doctor. Equipment is outdated the personel could care if you lived or died. The deal with even the ones that claim they did get empirical evidence from supposed scientists. I'd like to see the real data, tests subjects, and generally to see who benefitted from these tests. Chinese medicine works for little things but on the whole your rolling the dice with your life because of propoganda that has been passed down from centuries. Chinese will believe anything another Chinese tells them reguardless how it outlandish it may seem, hence the snake oil salesmen proliferate like wildfire yet Chinese government bans a lot of fact based tried and tested western medicines stating side effects or no good for the common people. Actually it's an elaborate conspiracy perpetrated by the government in collusion with the manufactures of this Mickey Mouse supposed remedies. The reall beauty of this is that Chinese don't question, but just follow like good little sheep. In America I can buy these blue generic sleep aids from Walgreens, {safe with little or no side affects}. In China and Hong Kong can only get it in a cold formulation, so I'm forced to buy a very powerful sedative Ambiem {Zolium} to do the trick. Another ironic note is that the Chinese government are considering to ban John Q. Citizen from buying antibiotics from over the counter because of the rampant abuse of these effective yet should be sparingly used. It's funny how backwards things are here. I'd personally prefer the side effects that prolong any illness or unecessary pain. Yell

Follow the Path Less Chosen and You Will Reap the Rewards of Life.