I can't go into a long deposition with all of the intimate details, but I can answer questions pertinent to this post.

The attention-getter: The intimacy and -beep- was excellent and repeated.

Basic details: we work at the same company in China but not the same office. She's married and miserable, and has a baby. I'm a married and miserable westerner without children; it's basically over, and my future ex-wife would agree (i.e., I'm not a thrill-seeker; I want to be married again, and [really!] first time I've ever been with someone else during my marriage). We went on a business trip recently, and things went very, very well for both of us. Like I said above, the intimacy and -beep- was excellent and repeated.

I'm certain that she wasn't using me as a -beep- toy. I have many reasons to be sure of this, but if she's an excellent actor then I'm willing to admit that I'm wrong. I'm convinced, though, that she wants to be with me as much as I want to be with her. It's just that she's scared.

I know just enough about Chinese culture to understand why she's scared. Face. And her child. I think, though, mostly her child, and she's right about it.

Her kid is great, and I'm absolutely sure that I can be a great father to him and to our (hopefully) future child/ren. And as much as it pains me to take a woman from an (unappreciative) man, taking his child is worse — and not just for him, but for his parents. Certainly leaving the child with him is out of the question.

I'll be here in China for several years, at least enough time for her baby to reach school age and to work out childhood logistics. In the meantime, I want to be with her, and marry her. She's willing, except for her fear about her child.

Let's assume that you can't change my mind with arguments about morality. I've accepted that I'd be a home-wrecker. I don't care; I'll make her a better home (I know this). I'm also not willing to deceive her. I want her to be happy, with or without me (although I know she's unhappy with her marriage now). I really *do* want a good, convincing argument that will open her mind to the possibility of being with me. In fact, I'm sure she *does* want to be with me, but her fear of losing face and the arguments over her son are the reasons for her fear. So, how do I reassure her?

Oh, her husband is out of town for the next five months or so. It will be pretty much the same life for her without him, though. I've asked her to consider "western-style dating" during this time. I *don't* want an er nai relationship, though — this is for real. I want to be with her as legal partners.

Advice that would help us achieve our goals?

Laowaiink said

In China, a child (especially if it's a boy) belongs to the man's side of the family, and that side generally keeps him in the instance of divorce and will usually be raised by the grandparents (one of my wife's friends divorced her husband and now her son is being raised by her ex-husband's parents, and she hardly sees him).  Even if you will be a better father, you and his mother will have little or no say who the boy lives with, especially if the grandparents are very doting on the boy.  I don't want to wilt your flower; I just want to let you know how serious the issue of the child is for your partner and her family.

Thanks. This describes her hesitation exactly, even down to the doting grandparents. It's looking like a difficult barrier to overcome. I'm going to try, though. I'll anything up to (but not including) ruining her life in order to make this work. And obviously I'll be ruining (have ruined?) what my own life's been up until now. Surrender is out of the question unless she honestly tells me to get lost.