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Family and Money

家庭与金钱


Love or Money?

Chinese girls who are on the quest for their Mr. Right are often accused of being too materialistic (or simply – “gold-diggers”). This is an interesting topic which in the future I’d like to explore more in depth. But right now I want to take a look at some of my friends many of whom are already married (ding, ding – this is a hint to my boyfriend who will proofread the post before I publish it :-) ) and see how money issue influences their relationships.

My relative Caicai whose story was described in one of the previous posts didn’t have money even for a wedding. She and her husband have the dreams of better future and so far they are really happy.

Yang is my friend from primary school. She began dating her future husband in university. At the time when they married they had a small business (related to toll highways). It wasn’t very profitable at the beginning but slowly and steadily it grew and now they are expanding. There is no doubt that they are a very happy family. And among all the couples I know they are the only one who plan to have a second baby.

Lin is my other long-term friend. Both she and her husband came to Chongqing from Sichuan. He made few attempts to run his own business but every time failed. Since his income wasn’t very stable the family sometimes had to rely on Lin’s salary. But the last attempt had a better outcome. Her husband signed few deals with big clients and in a very short time made a good profit. Unfortunately, this change of luck was accompanied by a worsening of their relationship: Lin and her husband started quarreling and fighting and some time ago their marriage was at the brink of divorce.

Some readers know already the story of Ling and her jealous husband. What I haven’t mentioned is that for a long time she was the main bread-winner of the family. And only recently her husband’s salary became bigger. I won’t repeat what kind of bad treatment she receives from him now.

My ex-roommate Xiao Mi is currently single. Well, she has a boyfriend but is not ready to marry him for a very simple reason: he doesn’t have a house.

My other friend from middle school Yan has even higher expectations for her future husband. She is a very beautiful girl and has a successful career in real estate field. She always had many pursuers and currently has a boyfriend who seems to answer all of her strict requirements. They plan to marry soon.

What are my conclusions? Usually I try to be objective and backup my statements by citing some researches or other articles. But today I will express my personal – very subjective - opinion, and please, feel free to disagree with it. And also I call to my readers not to take it too seriously and not to forget their sense of humor.

First of all, it seems that both poor and rich couples can have a happy family life. The same applies to a possibility of having an unhappy life. Looking at the cases of my friends I see that the biggest threat of financial character to the happiness of family is a quick change of income for better (or for worse). The couple’s stability is challenged by unexpectedly bad or good situation and not always they handle it properly.

Reading different articles in internet about love and family I often encountered analogies from the world of economics. Such terms as “marriage market” or “love market” are quite common. Marriage market, for example, refers to dynamics of demand and supply when each person is simultaneously the buyer and the seller. Based on his/her age, level of education, physical attractiveness and so on everyone has a price tag of X units. Naturally, he/she looks for a match with a similar price. In this perspective the expression “wow, he’s quite a catch” can be understood almost literally.

By the way, it seems that Chinese girls have a short expiry date. If yet unmarried, from the age of late twenties, they are transferred to a cheaper category with a special label “sheng nu” (leftovers).

The rules of marriage market can explain why sudden changes of family’s financial background have a negative impact on relationship. If dating is a kind of market research – then marriage itself is a contract. This contract is “signed” between two parties and each of them brings in his/her merits and drawbacks in exchange for the partner’s qualities.  Financial situation is one of such merits and an integral part of the deal. Here partners take in account not only the current level of income but also the factors that can predict the perspectives of growth (spouse’s capabilities, education, job).

But suddenly the situation changes to a bigger extent than expected. For example, husband begins to earn much more. Wow! Now he feels that he is giving more and the deal is not quite fair, he can change his current wife for a newer and more shiny model.

Here I want to quote the words of Felix Dennis – a rich British entrepreneur:

People who grow rich almost always improve their sex life. More people want to have sex with them. That’s just the way human beings work. Money is power. Power is an aphrodisiac. Money did not make me happy. But it definitely improved my sex life.

In this light the words of marriage vows “I promise to be true to you in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health” is a kind of insurance (which, however, is not easy to cash in when the time comes).

All this sounds quite pessimistic. You may wonder if I really think that everything revolves around money. No, I don’t think so and hope that I am not an exception :-) . As I stated before – don’t take this post very seriously – consider it as a joke (but joke which has a little bit of truth to it…)  Honestly speaking I think that the most important factor of happy family life is an ability to communicate and talk together about anything (including such sensitive topic as money).

Marriage market researcher, Crystal Tao

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  • http://blog.clarknielsen.com Clark

    It was common thinking amongst my Chinese male friends that they needed to buy a house (actually own it, can’t just rent), have a car, etc. etc. before they could get married. Sure, everyone should be somewhat financially stable before they get married, but Chinese culture takes this to an extreme.

    • http://www.magnoliaarts.com TLB

      @Clark, I agree with your comment; I think the Chinese are taking this “have to own a house or apartment” thing too far. I haven’t seen the series mentioned below, and I suspect it has to do with a signal about financial stability; but surely there are ways to show that without actually purchasing a house or apartment.

      After my divorce 4 years ago, I really enjoyed renting again: I could move when I wanted, and someone else had to fix anything that broke! The money I saved renting over buying went toward replenishing savings, and the result was that I had more disposable income. I’m not necessarily advocating renting over buying for everyone — just saying I’d want to know why this is such a big deal in China. I don’t think so much should depend on just one measure of financial stability (一棍子打死).

      Tim

      • bigmaninchina

        Wanted to jump in to this discussion… For some background, I’m what folks call an ABC (American born Chinese) and for the most part you can say that I am not Chinese other than my appearance. 3 years ago I married a wonderful Shanghainese girl and although a “house” wasn’t a requirement of marriage, there was always a small amount of pressure.

        Here’s what I have come to realize from that small amount of pressure. I think when discussing what seems to be a requirement for marriage we need to look at it in terms of dollar & cents rather than just as a cultural thing. If a “white-collar” guy here in Shanghai with a decent education makes around 8,000 RMB per month (before taxes) wants to buy an apartment for 1.2 million RMB (and this is dirt cheap nowadays) he would need to come up with 360,000 RMB at a minimum just to take out a loan, and over 6,000 a month mortgage payment. The reality is that the numbers are truthfully overwhelming, and I believe, this is a case were financial stability doesn’t translate into being able to afford property. So in a way you can say that if you don’t have a house/apartment of your own now, it’s not likely you’ll be able to afford one in the future. The big worry for the girl’s parents is “where is my daughter going to live”, “are they going to rent for the rest of their lives”, and a big one for my in-laws “you’re not going to have a baby while living in a house that’s not yours, are you, what if they kick you out”.

        I think the “sky’s the limit” attitude that we live by in “the West” where the young boy with lots of potential can work his way up the corporate ladder and buy that dream home really gets trumped by reality here in China. I think longing for a house in China is not much different from the “American Dream”, but unfortunately here in China sometimes the “limit’s the sky” and practicality rules over it all.

        I have a lot of opinions of the happenings in China, but this is one that I can say I totally understand.

        PS – Crystal, I’ve been following your articles for a while now and it’s great to read your thoughts and reconcile them with my personal experiences being married to a Chinese girl. Thanks for sharing, looking forward to reading more in the future…

        • John

          I’m also an ABC. I only look Chinese…I can’t read/write the language and I have difficulty speaking it. I came to China from the US after I was offered a position in China and I thought it would be a good learning experience to live abroad. I have been in China for a couple of years now and I have to say that I have not felt any of these social pressures.

          My question is, does it matter if a person actually OWNS a house or a car?

          I still rent and the rent for my one bedroom apartment is 9,000RMB per month. Yes, it’s a waste of money, but I don’t want to deal with the responsibility of owning my own place yet. And even though I don’t have my own car, my office allows me to use one of the company cars, a Range Rover, whenever I want to so I take it home a lot. I haven’t bought a car because I travel for about half the week for my job. But I still find time to go out on dates, I’m a very social person.

          The girls who I date all know that I don’t own any of this and they don’t seem to care, none of them have pressure me to buy my own house or car. Now I do admit that I can easily afford a car and a decent house if I wanted to, my salary is about 110,000RMB per month because I get paid in USD. And no, I don’t buy any of the girls expensive gifts or clothes.

          So how important is it to actually have something under your own name? Because I do hear about this but have not experienced it myself so that’s what makes me a little confused…

          • bigmaninchina

            @John – The bottom line is “yes” you do have to actually own it… but this is ultimately based on the family. I can only speak from my experience. I believe that the girls you’re dating won’t bring it up until things start looking like marriage. The ones who bring it up early on, you might want to be careful with as I believe it’s a red flag. As I mentioned, I believe that the “requirement” is a function of economics, and in most normal cases it’s based on the future well being of the daughter. You may or may not know this, but here in Shanghai, and I’m sure other places in China, when a boy is born his parents already know their responsibility, that is to make sure he has a house/apartment of his own so that he can get married. From the girls parents’ perspective they are looking for a son in-law who himself/parents/family have the ability to fulfill that. As I said, if you can’t afford a house now you’re not likely to be able to in the future, and just because YOU know that that’s not true for your situation, doesn’t mean that THEY do, and it doesn’t mean that they can easily detach from the nervousness of sending their daughter off to a marriage where she might not ever have a place to call home.

            I’ve also come to find that apart from the girl and her parents, there are all the relatives, which was compounded in my case because I married a Shanghainese girl, in Shanghai, with all the extended family’s eyes on the new foreigner in the family. For me, even though the parents and my wife didn’t follow the norm of requiring a house, the extended family was always wondering, constantly asking my in-laws where we bought our house. My in-laws ended up creating a big lie saying the the place where I was renting I actually bought just to stop the questions, and now that I’ve actually bought a place they can say that I got tired of the old place and decided to buy a new one. Because don’t forget in ALL their eyes a foreigner has lots of money and should be able to buy a house at the drop of a hat.

            I think ultimately if things start getting serious it’s one of those topics that should be discussed with the same importance as things like “do you want to have kids in the future”. Because unlike the US where marriage leads to a house, unfortunately here in China the path is reversed and the social norm says that a house leads to marriage.

          • G$

            @John What-on-God’s-green-Earth (not even remotely religious, but using this phrase for emphasis) are you doing that you get paid 110,000 RMB/mo?! That’s ridiculously extravagant. :shock:

        • http://www.lovelovechina.com Crystal

          Some of you perhaps heard this popular song showing the impossibly high prices of houses in China. It is very relevant to what @bigmaninchina wrote – so I will post the link to ChinaHush post here.
          Very true and very sad…

          • Ziccawei

            Wait til the govt starts issuing property tax in China.
            Then the fireworks will really go off.

            • keius

              Not really likely to happen anytime soon. And if it happens, it’ll be in some kind of isolated manner. Perhaps for businesses only as well as anything considered a second home. But as i say again, it won’t happen anytime soon. Why? The government knows that the vast majority of the population can’t afford it. Ingrained in the Chinese psyche is the knowledge that the home is the basis for “security” in a family. It’s what this article is really about.
              There are articles regarding the government considering property taxes available on the web. They in no way whatsoever mention taxes on the primary home, only on property beyond the first home, mostly to control speculation and profiteering.
              Anyway, i don’t see this happening anytime soon either. Why? The developers are pumping bribes and ‘cuts’ to gov’t officials to make sure this doesn’t happen. Local gov’ts typically have a vested interested in big development projects. Developers are able to hold onto unsold property without penalties because there are no property taxes they have to pay. In the US, developers have alot of costs associated with unsold properties. This doesn’t hold true for China. In this manner, the Chinese developers are able to keep realestate prices artificially high since there is no real need to lower prices and sell quickly.

    • http://asiancorrespondent.com Asian Market Girl

      im half chinese but i wasn’t raised in china. my husband is chinese… and he feels ashamed that he doesn’t own a house (like i do) when he married me.. we’re just 22

  • iawn

    Interesting. I am watching a Chinese mini-series Dwelling Narrowness, WoJu in pinyin. It is on once a week with 2 episodes here on this side of the Pacific. It is a fascinating story and shows the importance of owning a house/apartment in the equation of “living happily ever after”.I am into episode 12 and already I am beginning to empathize with the ” materialistic ” girls. As the marriage market goes, I wonder if people still believe in investing for the long term, like buy and hold instead of selling short. And how can the little guys, the old hundred names, afford to buy a house when housing price is so inflated? I definitely will continuing watching WoJu. Best of luck to your friends.

  • http://www.lovelovechina.com Crystal

    Aaa… “Wo Ju”!
    My elder cousin was “crazy” about those series :smile:

  • http://motpol.blogspot.com Hans Engnell

    I think you can avoid gold diggers by simply telling your date (in my case online date) that if you’re looking for money, please look elsewhere. I think that line kept some gold diggers away when I was looking for a Chinese girl friend online. Me and my girlfriend never really discussed money when we got to know each other, she never asked me how much money I have or make, which I took as a good sign. Now I know she’s never benn interested in anything but to marry a good guy. Life seems to be hard on Chinese women. In the West women can have children at 35 and get married at 40 and no one will think it’s anything strange about it.

    • http://www.lovelovechina.com Crystal

      Regarding money, sometimes people don’t realize that there might be an issue until they talk about it for the first time.
      As an example refer to a post written by Tim.

  • Shadowrune

    Hello again Crystal (谢谢你给我发了邮件,不过我都无法回:我女朋友天天都要监督我的邮箱!只要她发现我和另外一个女生有过联系,我就死定了呵呵。)

    This subject is one that’s been bothering me for a while. Is it actually normal for a Chinese girl to have both hands in her boyfriend’s wallet at any given time? This isn’t even a figure of speech, whenever I get home my girlfriend demands to check up on how much money I spent, and she checks up on my bank account, too. I’m about to go back to China after finishing my studies here, and I’m a tad worried about how I can keep control over my income. She’s demanding me to put all of my earnings into a “family account” which she wants to control. My common sense however doesn’t like this one bit, and whenever I try to tell her that I don’t mind buying her stuff, but that giving all of my earnings to someone else seems a bit too much, she starts yelling and calling me trash 垃圾, scumbag 混蛋 or downright a liar 骗子. I’ve got the feeling I’m in way over my head here. Any thoughts on this?

    • http://www.magnoliaarts.com TLB

      @Shadowrune,

      Seriously, your girlfriend reads your email? This is a girlfriend right, not a wife? You are indeed way over your head my friend, I’d run out of there as fast as my legs could take me.

      Nevermind the issue of being called trash and scumbag — that’d be enough to get me outta there!

      Best of luck to you; my advice, worth what you’re paying for it, is find a new girlfriend.

      • Shadowrune

        Her reading my e-mails has been going on for ages, that’s actually the least of my concerns… To bring it all into perspective, I’ve met her in China when I was studying Chinese there at the university. After half a year, the time of parting came but once I got here (with an exam to take), she made me buy a ticket back to China. By that time, she’d moved to another city so I followed her there, but I left after a month and a half to pursue my master’s degree after all…

        Back home, my parents wouldn’t let me move back in anymore so I had to find a job and repay my friends who’d borrowed me money. Working at 80% and writing my thesis and going to class during my spare time, I managed to get enough cash together to visit her and her family during Chunjie in January-February 2010. Actually during the entire academic year I got up at 5:00am every morning to give her a call when she had lunch break, and at night I’d call her using Skype to show her I wasn’t spending my time doing anything she wouldn’t allow. This has gone on until now, she fell asleep a while ago so I finally got some rest today…

        The thing is, back in February she found out I had received a mail from a friend, for which she actually slapped me in the face a couple of times and kicked me in the face while I was sleeping (which is when she found out). All of this I can forgive her, cause I really did love her once… It’s just that I’ve got an uneasy feeling whenever she wants me to do something and tells me I don’t mean anything to her and it’d be easy to go find someone else “with a big house and a BMW”.

        All right sorry, this has become quite a rant :) Cheers

        • Shadowrune

          Ah, and by the way, I did manage to obtain my master’s degree and I just bought my tickets back to China, found a job that isn’t all too bad! =) Take care and thanks for reading

          • Jay K.

            shadowrune..let me tell you something..1. you need to get a spine 2. be a man get your balls back 3. she is not worth it. 4 tell her to get back in the kitchen and make you some pie. 5 kick her tot he curb

            as russell peters said “Be a Man!”

        • Bill

          Shadowrune – seriously, any guy who puts up with all this deserves what he gets. Even if ‘love’ is in the picture, most certainly respect is not. You need to dump her, and get a backbone before finding another girl.

          • Shadowrune

            Strange thing really, you’re probably right. When all this started I had one of my European friends telling me I had to learn to calm down and not get mad at her. I think I might’ve gone a bit too far down that road, thanks for spelling it out for me like that. Got only myself to blame, so I’ll try to resolve the situation and get some 骨气 (backbone, as you say) before venturing out again! Cheers

            • http://www.magnoliaarts.com TLB

              Your European friends are right; don’t get mad and stay calm. Calmly approach her and calmly tell her that you’re no longer interested in being her boyfriend.

              And congrats on the degree and the job! :grin:

              Now, based on this article, you can demand a higher price (i.e, a better girlfriend) for your time and energy! :grin:

        • keius

          Man….don’t even know where to start.
          I’ll just say one thing.
          Do you trust her and does she trust you?
          No?
          Dump her and get it over with. It can only end badly, or worse.
          You sound like you’ve got a masochistic streak in you ;-)

    • http://www.lovelovechina.com Crystal

      Oh, poor guy. 那我希望你能及时地删掉我的邮件因为里面有我博客网址的链接。呵呵,祝你好运!

      Though I agree with what was said about your girl’s behavior – I feel a duty to try and give some explanation to it.

      Chinese girls like to boast to each other about how well their boyfriends/husbands treat them. One of the favorite “proves” that they bring is that the boyfriend/husband gives them all salary. For example, read my post about Caicai. Since you know Chinese language – follow the link to Caicai’s personal blog. You will easily find the article which I translated in that post but omitted some sentences. One of them was when Caicai “showed off” how much her husband loves her and mentioned that each month he gives her all his salary. You see?

      And it’s not only her. Yang (whom I mentioned in this post), oh – she is sooo proud that her husband gives her all money. In fact, she was managing their common bank account even before they got married.

      Generally speaking, we believe that women are better at taking control over family’s budget. Because if Chinese men have money, they will spend it on mahjong, KTV or dinners/drinks with friends and colleagues for “face” things.

      Now imagine that your girlfriend all the time listens to these stories from her friends/relatives/mom. Then with these ideas of how the things should work she comes to you and … further you know yourself.

      • Nick

        Crystal, when I read these posts, I realise just how fortunate I am to have found such an angel in my Ivy. Yes, she has an MBA and is truly a wiz with finances, and I plan to allow her to take care of such things, but she has NEVER demanded anything like that of me.

        And to Crystal’s boyfriend – Hurry up and marry this lady! You are both young. You don’t know how lucky you are to have found such a treasure.

        And to TLB: You can still turn from the dark side (management) and save your soul!

  • http://www.magnoliaarts.com TLB

    Thanks Crystal for another fascinating article. A couple of points:

    1. To Crystal’s boyfriend: MARRY THIS LADY, OKAY? She’s beautiful, she’s smart — either of those pose a problem for you? :roll:

    2. Crystal, very perceptive point about the addition of stress to a life (and relationships) even when good things happen. I once read that (of course) divorce and the death of a loved one caused tremendous stress, but also that marriage and the birth of a child add significant stress to one’s life. (which makes perfect sense when you think about it)

    3. (sorry, I’m in management so I write a lot of emails with numbered items! :shock: )
    Perhaps this article reveals the dark side of the famous Chinese woman’s “practical” attitude about marriage. Everything has its good and bad effects, right? Generally, I admire this attitude, which seems to me to be: find a good person who treats you well, is financially stable (at least), and to whom you’re attracted and whom you enjoy being around, and marry that person (why do you need to look further?). In this case, it looks like the “practical” side has turned into an objectification and materialization of people, which is too bad. Even if I won the lottery and became an instant millionaire, I’d still marry my fiancee — we’d just have more money to spend together.

    I guess I’m saying that, in the case of relationships, 一分钱一分货 (suggesting a reasonable relationship between what you pay and the value of what you’ve bought) is a degrading way to do things, and ultimately bad for the lives of all involved.

    Just my opinion! :o

    Tim

  • Sugar Daddy

    Not really understand what you are tying to say except for the last sentence: “most important factor of happy family life is an ability to communicate”,though I don’t actually quite concure with what you say in this regard. Communication can be a very important element in maintaining a happy fresh family life, yet for any happy family life, love and mutual trust(sth spiritual not just financial) are indispensible and I think that’s probably why you are holding a pessimistic viewpoint on marriage when it comes to money.
    Money can be a very sensitive volatile catalyst in marriage. It helps maintain the quality of family life while it may also erode the couple’s minds. Even though it’s understandable that every girl wants to pick someone with solid economic foundation and prospects to match the benchmark for a perfect husband and provide a sense of security, yet the inception of marriage should not be always focused on the financial aspect.Rather the screening of potential husband in terms of the quality of his personality and the attachment you hold for each other should be given with more attention.Though I see this is more likely a typical Asian/Chinese mindset to pawn the future on someone she will be close with, still it will somehow interesting and lamenting when I see all the sideshows unfolding on china’s internet that some girls are doing whatever they can to bring themselves under the spotlight for a momentary lapse of gold digging
    China is making a headway at a speed that China and chinese people have never experienced before.It’s interesting to see where china is heading over.
    Nice writting. Keep on it. :)

    • http://www.lovelovechina.com Crystal

      In this context it’s hard not to mention the Chinese dating TV show “If you are the one” where one of the girls refused to go for a ride on bicycle with a guy saying that she would rather cry on the back seat of BMW.

      Isn’t it the reason why BMW is translated as “be my wife”? :lol:

      • Bai Long

        I have seen that dating TV show and and in particular where the girls with that girl’ infamous comment of the preference “weeping in a BMW”, which received a huge angry criticism from the audience.

        Anyway, the TV show was forced to change the rules during June-July because of too many “gold digger” girls who appeared in the TV show with highly provocative demands on their prospective male partners income etc. appearing on that the TV show.

  • Ziccawei

    I was talking to a Shanghainese girl the other week who has her own house, her own money and her own company – she is loaded.
    She pointed out that this whole idea of the husband and his requirement to own a house is a very new thing. A few years ago it wasn’t expected. I think it’s just materialism gone out of control. Most people getting married now are 80′s generation and all they have had in their lives is the opportunity to spend other peoples money (six pockets) and places to spend it. This is crossed-over into the need/desire for a house. A few years ago it was just a house. Now, in Shanghai at least, it’s a house in a downtown area, a car, possibly a car for the wife (a ‘shengnu’ in Shanghai told me that when she gets married her future husband will give her a BMW – I felt like saying ‘too late for you darling’) and now a ‘gift’ of 500,000 to the girls’ parents.
    I know another girl that did market research on this phenomenon. It’s staggering the sheer greed that some of these girls (and particularly their parents) who commodify the girl and sell her off.
    To Shadowrune – tell your girlfriend that masquerades as a human being to get lost – she is the one that is trash.
    Good morning everyone!

    :mrgreen:

  • Steve

    ‘Through thick and thin’ actually used to mean something. Nowadays whenever someone sees something they dislike in their partner, their first instinct is to make a mental note. “If they don’t change soon, I know I can find better.”

    You think you or your partner is different? Think about the way you shop. Why settle for second best when you know you can get something better? Pride in our own growing abilities and a consumerist attitude has made our appetite for ‘better things’ insatiable.

    Unfortunately for most people out there, marriage is the same. No longer are vows made ’till death do us part’. Realistically, it’s more like ’till I can find someone better’.

    Want to stick with someone for your entire life? Don’t ever stop improving on what you provide. The moment you become content is the moment you stop becoming competitive.

  • Kage Musha

    Well looking at the housing prices and the welfare of overall it simply is not realistic and the requirement of a house isn’t mandatory for every women+family.

    A friend of mine is still single and his parents have been pushing him to get married, so his parents gave him some millions to buy a house…just to make it easier to get married. Which he btw is still not :D

    Another friend of mine is married by now, but back then he didn’t own a house.

    Myself, when I tied the knot I didn’t own a house. We were still happy and now with our own house we are still equally happy…

    I think the issue of owning a house before being able to get married is being blown out of proportions in the media (includes all BBS, blogs and whatever) and thus shaping the expectations of many women+family.
    We must not forget that the stories we hear about women getting married to a guy with a house+car are usually the ones with a good financial background/parents. The number of guys like this are just a very small percentage, but do get the most (media) attention.

    “psst hey did you hear about xxx xx, she just got married with a loaded guy!”
    “oh wow I should get one as well”
    “he’s from xxx city, you should go there!”

  • Bill

    Just wondering if all this marriage=houseBMW stuff is mostly in the very big cities in China. We seem to be stuck on Shanghai and Beijing (and maybe Chongqing??), etc.

    What about the zillions of lesser places in China? Is it true there as well, just scaled down for the lower salaries and costs of living? I’m sure, to some extent, expectations have been raised everywhere in China.

    And I would love to hear a story or two that runs counter to all this materialism. I know there are folks not all caught up in the ‘keep up with the Jones’ mentality.

    • ~a

      Again, nothing to do with culture

      All people are like this

      How do you think old and ugly doctors, lawyers, hedge fund managers are getting hot 20 year olds? Difference is US middle class girls can afford a car on her own and can get a house with any middle class guy but a middle class Chinese girl can’t. To get a house and car a middle class Chinese girl has to go marry a legit upper class guy or a illegit middle class guy thats somehow making $ off the side

      • Ziccawei

        Absolute tosh.

        Of course it’s connected to culture. It is most definitely a ‘Chinese thing’ that the guy has to provide a house before getting married (do a Google search in English ‘buying a house before getting married’) – it’s only in China (and maybe other Asian countries) that this happens. Quite often the girl, and her parents, bring nothing to the table financially – the guy and his parents have to cough up the money.
        And it’s not always a girl-meets-rich-guy scenario – usually they are just normal city dwellers making average salary, but still the guy has to buy a house.
        With this in mind, I imagine that many parents look at their son’s potential marriage partner and have a very strong say in the deal – after all, they have a very serious financial investment in this arrangement and don’t want their son hooking up with any old trash.
        The usual arrangement is this – guy buys house with help from his parents and (maybe) two sets of grandparents. Finds wife, parents give approval, gets married, has kid, rinse repeat.
        When property tax gets introduced in China it will cause a huge shit storm.

        • http://asiancorrepondent.com Asia News Girl

          Yes it is about culture, I agree… But it is also basic necessity right? Shelter and security.

          • Ziccawei

            Yes, basic shelter – many many newly married couples rent an apartment or house. This is still basic shelter. In China it’s about wanting to have some kind of financial ‘reward’. It’s like the girls’ parents are saying ‘we’ll give you our daughter if you put her name on the property deeds of a downtown apartment’.
            It’s 80′s generation Chinese greed – it’s about money.
            This ain’t nothing – the 90′s generation regard the 80′s generation as ‘jelly’.

            • http://asiancorrespondent.com Asia News Girl

              I want to disagree with the last sentence, but I really can’t! Hahaha.

        • ~

          Its only about the money and nothing more

          The median US household income is about $50000. Its easy to buy a nice 2-3 bedroom house with a garage for about 150000 as long as you’re not within 20 miles of any major city. So for Americans, a nice house is only about 3x their gross income. This isn’t possible in China. To be able to buy a house shows you or your family is pretty well off since the Chinese just don’t use bank loans as much as Americans

          Americans might not have to have a house but the groom or his family is often expected to pay for the entire or majority of the wedding

          Its about the money

  • Jay K.

    as much as i am against property tax in a country where actual ownership of the house is more like a 50/70 year lease period, i actually think its a good idea. i am not one for chaos but causing a huge shit storm like many of you have already stated would i hope knock down the materialism a few pegs down in china, so everyone can have a reality check in the mirror, especially for those who buy multiple houses.

    i’m sorry for going off topic, but this past monday i was at the water cooler doing the cooler talk with colleagues. and they asked me so your half jewish (shalom!) from the u.s. how come you dont have a house and your parents only have one house. one of the clients who talks with me a lot also mentioned how he makes cash money like no other. said “yeah i have 2 houses, maybe thinking of a 3rd, im sure jewish people can afford so many things”…lng story short i told these guys, u should be happy back home in NY(i need to leave this place, my inner cowboy is calling me to texas) my parents are paying almost 10 grand (68,000~rmb) a year on tax, like property tax, school tax, etc each year. imagine owning 2 houses that’s 20,000 (135,500~rmb) and doing it for the rest of your life. and as we all yanks know, u can never escape uncle sam with tax…

    • Kage Musha

      Property Tax lol
      Look at the house prices, it’s already crazy in the 1-tier cities, the 2-tier cities are getting close there.
      Property Tax won’t knock down materialism at all, it will only hurt the ones on the bottom of the buy/own house ladder.

  • Ziccawei

    Yeah that’s the crazy thing here – the only ‘own’ the house for 50/70 years…. It’s nuts. Actually – it’s China.

    • http://www.lovelovechina.com Crystal

      Maybe it’s because many houses are of such quality that they don’t stay longer than 50/70 years :smile:

      • Ziccawei

        Their business plan is perfect, isn’t it?
        Build shoddy houses, get people to pay exorbitant prices for them and if they haven’t fallen down in 70 years the govt can claim the property back again anyway.
        Rinse/Repeat.

  • Loukasrb

    Women, all women are hard coded in their DNA to be attracted to men who are ambitious.  It’s NOT the money they are attracted to.  It’s the ambitious man, and his wealth demonstrates ambition.